Hi guys,
I'm adding a page to the website with suggestions of good distros for Linux beginners. So far, I have Ubuntu, Ubuntu MATE, Linux Mint, and Elementary OS. What do you think of those? And what do you think should be added? Let me know why you think so, too. Remember, try to think like a beginner to Linux.
Thanks!
Haven't used it for a while, but PCLinuxOS used to be easy, solid and friendly. Bob has used it I'm pretty sur.
Yeah, I think PCLOS is a good beginner one. Why do you personally think it's good for beginners?
I also agree with Buster, about PCLOS.
I have t fired it up in probably over a year, but I believe it was good because it tended to work properly, with all the notebook computer hardware. Especially wifi.
I believe a new version has just been issued, so I will have to boot it Live, from a USB pen drive and give it a look again.
PCLOS is I think still based on the RedHat Distro, so it was interesting working with that platform and package manager.
Used to have a win7 layout, so everything is where it would be expect it to be. It just works. Can't remember having to tinker. Lots of good help at the forum.
Since it has a rolling update, there is some complexity in the process of keeping it up to date. Not for us but for beginners. But the extensive 'knowledge base' has all this. Here is probably the most difficult procedure:
http://www.pclinuxoshelp.com/index.php/Update_Your_PCLinuxOS
Very good to know! Thanks Buster! :-)
'PCLOS is I think still based on the RedHat Distro'
Sort of. Its parent was Mandrake, its grandparent RedHat. Good genes.
Quote from: buster on March 13, 2017, 09:36:33 AM
Used to have a win7 layout, so everything is where it would be expect it to be. It just works. Can't remember having to tinker. Lots of good help at the forum.
Since it has a rolling update, there is some complexity in the process of keeping it up to date. Not for us but for beginners. But the extensive 'knowledge base' has all this. Here is probably the most difficult procedure:
http://www.pclinuxoshelp.com/index.php/Update_Your_PCLinuxOS
Hmm, the update procedure might remove it from the "beginner" category. Synaptic is a bit scary (I think) to new users of Linux. Also, I'd expect a beginner distro to at least remind you of when you need updates. Being rolling release, I also expect a LOT of updates, more than is normal for most distros. That might also be daunting to new users.
The instructions for an update does say, at the very end, that a person does not have to do updates. Previous releases can still be used..
This is a direct quote from their website:
It is recommended that you do a proper system update as outlined below once every week or two.
It may be a problem for new users.
Linux Lite has good update software, but during the update you see text. Maybe I get asked 'yes or no'. Can't remember.
Ubuntu Mate gets my vote.
What do you guys think about MkLinux MXLinux for beginners?
Quote from: ssfc72 on March 13, 2017, 01:15:14 PM
The instructions for an update does say, at the very end, that a person does not have to do updates. Previous releases can still be used..
It does say that previous releases can be used but it says that in the context of it being a rolling release distribution. That is, along as you keep updating, you will always have the latest PCLOS. You don't need to download the latest ISO to upgrade. That's how I understand it.
Are you just kidding around with this suggestion? MkLinux which doesn't even show up on Distrowatch? Are you playing with us Jason?
The latest date I could find is 2009.
Other than that it looks good.
Sorry, I meant MXLinux.
I used it for awhile. I wouldn't recommend it for a few more months. Should be good soon.
By the way, it's raining here, and we have an Internet connection. So I read and write to pass the time.
I want to advance a vote for elementaryOS. It's very Mac, for all those expatriates, and I think it just gets on with stuff. What you need is there, though you'll forgive an old CLI guy for not really knowing about GUI update tools. Mike advanced it in the day because it did wifi that most other stuff still wasn't doing.
I love how no one has stated the obvious answer. Ubuntu, it has the widest hardware support and most of all the most active support forums the most documentation. The most built in documentation, the easiest install process, the cleanest end user friendly interface. It has familiar applications. The update process is straight forward (and notifies instead of having to search for "how do I update my computer") It has GUI package management and a store like interface for finding new software. It supports gaming via Steam. It has paid support and tons of funding in the back end. And most importantly LTS and staying power.
Linux is great but it's only as good as the community. Gentoo imploded it seems because it was too geeky and they RTFM'd themselves into a corner. Debian is a great foundation but took many many many attempts at tossing a gui on it before it became a full fledged desktop OS.
Also plug and play device support for speakers, headsets printers scanners. The ability to watch movies and listen to music out of the box. And to use newer services like spotify are kind of a must now it seems. Plus after looking at all the folks I know who have "tried" linux, vs those who still USE linux 90% of the people who stuck it out did so with Ubuntu.
I am personally not a fan, but then again I haven't been a regular plain old Computer "user" since 1997.
When Ubuntu went to Unity, many went to alternatives to get an old style desktop. Hence Ubuntu Mate. Same good stuff underneath.
There is nothing difficult about operating Unity on Ubuntu. I certainly had no trouble adapting to it, though I have never been a Windows user. If you're a millennial (which I am not), it might actually be easier to adapt to than Mate because you would be used to using a smartphone interface.
Anything is easier than this I am sure. If you want windows-like stick with windows. Keep to your strengths if you are looking for an alternative then some changes to how things work need to be made. Want a better Apple? just stick with apple and wait for them to improve. Distro hopping leads to frustration and burnout. Unless like most of us here you have that itch in your brain.
I <3 virtualization for that exact fact. I no loner need 4012+ desktops and laptops and hours of setup I can run 16+ virtual machines on my laptop and test all the things.
Even still from an adoption standpoint and clearly defined and sensible setup then Ubuntu (insert flavour of the week here) is best. Not so bleeding edge that it's scary and sharp and twitchy. And not so old that it provides no benefit over sticking it out with Tried and true Win7. 10 is starting to scare people.
'There is nothing difficult about operating Unity on Ubuntu.'
Not really for us. I agree Mike. But I spend time coaching people who have gone from XP to Win7 and think of that as what a computer looks like. And they are very comfortable with it. I would put them into a win7 look-alike. Young people with tablets were comfortable with win8 (a much maligned system) and Unity.
Depends on their computer moxie and general adaptability. By the way, almost anyone can find their way through win7, even if they despise the look.
Quote from: cod3poet on March 14, 2017, 07:49:06 AM
I love how no one has stated the obvious answer.
That's probably because I mentioned up front that I already had it on the list of good distros for beginners in my initial post.
Granted that it does depend on your experience with computers in general but I think anybody can adapt to the Unity paradigm with some effort. I'd still put Ubuntu MATE and elementary ahead of it because more people are used to the Win7 or Mac look. Microsoft is dropping support for Vista in April or May, I believe so there may be some people looking for alternatives.
If people have money to burn, I have no problem recommending Macs to novice or beginning computer users. I'd never recommend Windows to them because of the malware out there. The interface is great to use in Windows 7 and it's alright in Windows 10 despite the silly tiles. But there is too much bad stuff out there waiting to infect their Windows box and novice (and often intermediate) users seem to have no problem finding it. If they're experienced enough to protect themselves from malware, I'd say to try Linux if they applications they use can be found in Linux. For this reason, I often promote cross-platform software like Chrome, VLC Player, Filezilla, LibreOffice, Spotify, Skype as it makes things easier when people want to transition.
Good point about Spotify, Brian. And a lot of other add-ons from various Internet services support Ubuntu (or Ubuntu-based distros with compatible desktops) out of the box, like Private Internet Access though that's probably beyond the beginner stage to think about it.
Quote from: bobf on March 14, 2017, 01:45:33 AM
I want to advance a vote for elementaryOS. It's very Mac, for all those expatriates, and I think it just gets on with stuff. What you need is there, though you'll forgive an old CLI guy for not really knowing about GUI update tools. Mike advanced it in the day because it did wifi that most other stuff still wasn't doing.
I forgot about how it supported some wireless when other distros didn't. Thanks for reminding me of this, Bob.
"If people have money to burn, I have no problem recommending Macs to novice or beginning computer users."
My non-computer type friends use Apple, more I think for cult reasons than computer reasons. But they find it easy.
A DistroWatch review suggested Mageia would be a good beginner's distro: "Mageia is a solid distribution, easy to install and pleasant to use. I definitely think it should be recommended for novice Linux users more than it is. "
I was considering Mageia and openSUSE, both because of their special control centre/setup software. OpenSUSE can make the updating process seem pretty complicated when you're doing stuff like installing codecs though. Nothing that would bother us guys but might scare beginners. Mageia might be a good pick. I'll take another look at it. Thanks.
I agree with Jason about openSUSE. I think it's an excellent distro (especially the LEAP version). Although it isn't hard at all to install or operate, some of the steps for installing codecs and other apps, even using the openSUSE build service, take more sophistication than most beginners would have. As for elementary OS, Bob is right that one of its particular advantages specific to being Ubuntu-based is that even the Broadcom wifi works right out of the box. I'm not sure about Mint, but most Ubuntu-based distros require either a temporary connection to ethernet or a separate download and install of the correct Broadcom driver to get it working. So this is a big advantage for elementary OS, and it should be listed in the "good for beginners" group.
Here's the page thus far.
http://plugintolinux.ca/ and then click on "Beginner Linux Distros" on the menu at the top.
I will take into consideration your further suggestions and probably at Mageia to the list. I don't want the list to be too big so it's easy for beginners to pick something. I plan on keeping it as a page I update every 6 or 12 months in case there are big changes to the scene.
Comments are the text are appreciated. I thought about making this a wiki but I don't know if anybody would be open to being an occasional contributor/editor to it.
The Beginner's page looks good, Jason.
Quote from: bobf on March 17, 2017, 02:12:26 AM
The Beginner's page looks good, Jason.
Thank you, sir.
"Ubuntu MATE Is Now An Official Ubuntu Flavor"
http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2015/02/ubuntu-mate-is-now-an-official-ubuntu-flavor
And Wikipedia notes this as well. Happened in Feb 2015
Quote from: buster on March 17, 2017, 08:53:47 AM
"Ubuntu MATE Is Now An Official Ubuntu Flavor"
http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2015/02/ubuntu-mate-is-now-an-official-ubuntu-flavor
And Wikipedia notes this as well. Happened in Feb 2015
Interesting. I think I had read this and just noted that it wasn't an official Canonical project.
QuoteIs Ubuntu MATE an official Canonical project?
No, it is an Ubuntu community project.
But then lower down it also says:
QuoteIs Ubuntu MATE an official Ubuntu “flavour�
Ubuntu MATE 15.04 and onward are official Ubuntu flavours.
Ubuntu MATE 14.04 and Ubuntu MATE 14.10 are unofficial builds.
Source: https://ubuntu-mate.org/faq/
I"m assuming they're saying that Canonical doesn't direct them but Canonical is okay with them? This sounds like only something that the developers would understand the nuance of. I don't know how it affects the project for us end-users.
Though it's not that obvious to find (have to go right to the bottom), there is a page for Ubuntu "flavours" here and Ubuntu MATE is on so I'll remove the "spin-off" language. Thanks for the info, Harry.
https://www.ubuntu.com/download/ubuntu-flavours
Something else in favour of Ubuntu mate:
If you check for updates through Software Updater, it finds the security and important needed updates and lets you proceed without a password. When you try to add software in general, because you are altering the system, you must enter your password.
That seems a really good compromise for someone learning the role of an administrator in Linux, as opposed to the Windows environment where the user is automatically root.
That's interesting. Is that only when you ran the updater yourself? I tried that way and you're right there, no password required. I think it still asks you for your password when it runs automatically though but maybe not. Will have to wait for it to come up again :)
OK. After many days have passed the Oracle has spoken to me and said
#1. Linux Mint Cinnamon
#2. Linux Lite
#3. Ubuntu Mate
Or any order of these three.
I have all those on the list. So that's cool :) Come out and have a coffee with us tonight, Harry!
Late in the game, but MXLinux is really easy. Quick and nice to work with. But I must admit that easy for us isn't easy for a newcomer. Still, it's as easy as Lite, Mint, and far easier than Ubuntu Gnome, at least to me.
As a side issue, curious to know if anyone, except intellectual Mike, uses Gnome. Or Fedora for that matter. The key word is 'uses', as in not just experiments with, or plays with.
"Intellectual Mike" has tried Fedora on several occasions, something between "playing" and "using". I find it fairly easy to use (though not as easy as the other distros listed here), but I don't see any advantages of using it over Ubuntu, especially since both are gnome distros. Stock gnome, which is more or less what you get with Fedora, is too bare-bones for me. The gnome customizations done by Ubuntu are more up my alley, and have actually led me away from Unity, which I was using until 18.04 came out.
A new article just came out with best Linux distros for beginners; read it here (https://thishosting.rocks/best-linux-distros-beginners/). Has the usual suspects (Mint, Ubuntu, Elementary) and a few that are on some lists (Peppermint, Solus, Zorin). The one that surprised me most was Manjaro. I would never put a rolling release distro on a beginner list, no matter how user-friendly.
I'd tend to agree although I note that they mention in the write-up that this is controversial. Never heard of Solus for beginners before.
I tried Solus about a year ago. It's pretty easy to install, run and maintain. The Budgie desktop is intuitive. The only issue with Solus as far as I am concerned is that, being an independent distro, the repositories are small compared to the majors. That would be a problem for me because I use some specialized software in my research, but most of the consumer programs are either installed or available in their repos. Also, their devs seem quite amenable to packaging software that users request.
You might have forgotten that I demonstrated Solus at a meeting probably a couple of years ago now. I'm just not sure about recommending it for beginners because I'm thinking the support community is going to be smaller since it's independently developed. For example, with Ubuntu-based distros, you can get help from the Ubuntu community, so if you're using Linux Mint, you can likely get help from there if you can't get it with the Mint community.
I don't know if that's true or not with Solus; it might depend on what you need help with. When I requested that an app be packaged for use in Solus, I got a pretty quick and positive response. But that doesn't invalidate the concern I would have about recommending Solus to a beginner.
Downloaded and tried Xubuntu, the latest. Can't see using it ahead of Linux Lite or MX linux which are very polished. Surprised actually. But the other two are better xfce desktops I think.
And tested Kubuntu, same release, and felt the same way when comparing to other Plasma distros, such as Mageia, tho maybe Mageia is not for beginners. Have trouble with the menu. Tried to make it open up with a mouse hover but no luck. If you don't mind some qlicks at some stages it's clear and easy.
At the moment, for beginners, impressed with deepin, Lite, MX, and Mint Cinnamon (unless of course Bill objects!).
Quote from: buster on April 17, 2019, 05:16:50 PM
And tested Kubuntu, same release, and felt the same way when comparing to other Plasma distros, such as Mageia, tho maybe Mageia is not for beginners. Have trouble with the menu. Tried to make it open up with a mouse hover but no luck. If you don't mind some clicks at some stages it's clear and easy.
I think that Kubuntu uses the Application Launcher by default which doesn't have cascading popup menus which is possibly why hovering didn't work for you. If you right-click the K button, choose Alternatives and then choose Application Menu, that's probably more what you want. I became so used to the giant icons in Fedora WS with Gnome that now I use the Application Dashboard which I thought horrible before. Funny how using something frequently can bias you against even things you liked recently.
I did not find the Alternate Widgets. That would have done what I wanted.
Quote from: BusterE on April 19, 2019, 02:17:47 PM
I did not find the Alternate Widgets. That would have done what I wanted.
Do you mean it wasn't installed or you just didn't know about the option? Because I don't think I did anything special to add that although I have noticed it missing in some Plasma desktops.
I didn't know about the option. So this morning I downloaded and installed the new Kubuntu 19.04 and made the menu change. Played a bit and noticed it has the 'windows' key + arrow key to move a window to side of screen, and it has split screen and it has...
Pretty impressive. Not sure why it's way down at 44 on DW. But then we have a cornucopia of excellent distros now I guess.
Quote from: buster on April 20, 2019, 10:07:50 AM
Pretty impressive. Not sure why it's way down at 44 on DW. But then we have a cornucopia of excellent distros now I guess.
I don't think Plasma is all that popular. I'm possibly the only person in the club who uses it as their main desktop. And that may because it has a reputation for being too complicated with too many options in settings. But I think they've made it a lot easier since the advent of Plasma. Versions 4.x were harder to use, IMHO.
I think we might consider removing this thread, or putting a warning on the first page or in the title that it is quite old. And then start a new one. Many of us would consider quite a different distro after more than two years.
Quote from: buster on May 10, 2021, 02:02:51 PM
I think we might consider removing this thread, or putting a warning on the first page or in the title that it is quite old. And then start a new one. Many of us would consider quite a different distro after more than two years.
After 30 days, every topic, even if covered before should be started with a new one. It warns the commenters that it's been 30 days since the last post and they should consider starting a new topic. I agree that we should do that. For historical reasons, I want to keep the topic and anyone seeing it should notice the date showing how old it is. That's also why we should start new topics after 30 days and old threats with outdated comments will drift to the bottom. I can lock this topic though so there aren't any more posts. I'll do that after waiting for a day in case you want to respond to this post.